A Very Personal Question

[Jared]

I've chosen to ask this question on Tir Na rather than the other place (?!), because the very question will demonstrate my naivity, when it comes to listening to Classical Music and I can already hear some of the answers I'll get, before I press send...

... and yet this is something which has concerned me a great deal for some time, so I'm going to ask.

There are certain pieces, composers or even styles of classical music, which I just cannot find the ability to appreciate and enjoy, no matter how hard I try. I won't name any specific pieces, because it takes our eye off the ball. Furthermore, people get very passionate indeed about their favourites, and the 'pro' lobby will always be completely mystified by your inability to appreciate genius when its staring you in the face, and that the fault clearly lies with you, because you obviously haven't given their works a long enough airing. Either that or you've not started listening to the right works, you've got the wrong conductor/orchestra and frankly, you've not been listening deeply enough with your eyes closed.

Now, I'm not saying that you intelligent, restrained, mature Dubliners would react like that, but its something I've built up a real complex about, and have already conceded many times that the fault lies with me, rather than the composer concerned.

Now, not everyone on here likes every work of CM that has ever been written (surely?!?) so there must have been occasions when you've listened to something new, and you hit a blank wall. You really just can't appreciate it. Or, if after half a dozen or so listens through, you can at least appreciate it, but just don't think you'll ever love it very much or want to listen to it very often in the future.

The real question is, what do you do about it? Are you more inclined to feel that:

a) Because many of your forum friends really rate it, that the problem lies with you therefore see it as a project to be worked on and make some concerted effort to give it some more airtime until you try to see what others enjoy in it?

b) Put it back on the shelf with a view to giving it another try in a year or so; after all it may not be for you now, but your tastes change and develop and it just may be one for the future.

c) Decide that you've given it a fair hearing and get rid of it. After all, you're not really that concerned how others feel about your tastes; it's a deeply personal matter. Furthermore, Art being long and life being short, the pragmatic view would be that its not really worth my spending time beating myself up over X, because there are only so many listening hours in a day, and it might ultimately mean that I won't have as much chance to appreciate as many of Handel's operas as I would have liked.

or indeed a combination of the above? I'd really love to hear the views of as many people who use this forum as possible...

Many thanks

[Diapason]

I'd be somewhere between b) and c), and only very rarely a). I don't expect to like everything I hear, no matter how well-regarded it is, and beyond a certain amount of effort that's always required to understand something new, I don't beat myself up about it too much. There are vast swathes of music (Mahler!) where I don't really see the attraction at the moment, but I strongly suspect I'll come back to it in due course. That's happened to me plenty of times already. In such cases I'm happy to admit it's purely a question of taste on my part, and nothing to do with a question of quality. There is plenty of music that I can and do appreciate but that I don't enjoy listening to, and most of my "serious" musician friends would be the same.

Of course, outside of the classical arena things get messier. That's a whole different ballgame.

[Ciaran]

Also somewhere between (b) and (c). When I was younger I often felt like (a), but now I can't be bothered with forcing myself to listen to things I don't enjoy. What I have found is that I've come round to some composers over the years and to lesser extent, gone off some I used to like. So you will appreciate some music eventually without really trying, and trying doesn't always work anyway!

Don't forget: it's meant to be for pleasure!

[fergus]

The first thing that I would say Jared is to agree with Ciaran. This is supposed to be about enjoyment and it is something that we have all come up against at some stage. I would not be concerned in the least about “your problem”....in fact I would be more concerned if you were not asking a question like this at your stage of listening to Classical Music. You have to remember for just how relative a short period of time that you are involved with this....and given that I most certainly would not call you naive; in fact I think that your development has been quite remarkable and that you are quite an astute listener and (now) commenter and that is in no way meant to be patronising!

So you do not like all of the styles, composers or individual works that you hear....let me ask you something; do you like all of the genres, directors and films that you watch?

I have a friend with whom I constantly discuss music and we have broadly the same tastes. Now there is this one piece that he considers to be literally the best piece of music that has ever been written and has apoplectic fits when I still tell him that I simply just don’t get it...all that I can do is just shrug my shoulders because I just don’t think so; and it is a work by a composer whom I admire greatly!

I would be more in the b) category above. I think that if you are concerned about a) you are definitely heading down the wrong road. What this, or any other, Forum is good at is exposing one to ideas that you may not have thought of yourself. You try out and sample what is suggested and if you don’t like it then you don’t like it. All of Art is such a subjective thing. The only thing that I would say is that I would never discount anything. I have been amazed at what I have come to like after saying at one time that I could never like such and such....never close a door.
The one thing that I try to do if I don’t like something is to articulate (to myself) why I don’t like it....if it is purely an emotional response then that is also good enough for me.

There is nothing wrong with the question that you are asking and I would not beat yourself up about it. You have done the right thing on your Classical Music journey thus far....you have sampled broadly, refined your listening and critical analysis and the next phase may be the decision phase....there is one area or one composer that really attracts me so perhaps I will focus more of my time and effort on that.


It just struck me that all of the above has just come from one who turned down a chance to hear one of the great works because I wanted to get some sleep so that I could be up long before dawn to watch Rugby being played live on the other side of the world!!!! I had better stop right there!!

[Diapason]

Meh, you can hear the piece anytime. The effect of live rugby can't be reproduced!

[DaveF]

I'd also be somewhere between (b) and (c) although probably leaning more towards (c). There are plenty of recordings on my shelf that I've left aside for the time being namely Bach cantatas which I can only take in small doses. But I have been coming around this type of classical music in the last year or so. I still find piano music difficult to listen to yet I'd quite happily listen to organ music for hours but occasionally I'll dig out some piano recordings just to see if they'll click.

[fergus]

Meh, you can hear the piece anytime. The effect of live rugby can't be reproduced!

LOL!!! Love it Simon!!!

[Jared]

I think the first thing I want to say is 'thanks' to all of you for taking the time out to offer responses, which have been very helpful... especially you, Fergus. I think Fergus & Sean (who I've been chatting to online on and off for a couple of years now) know that I do beat myself up about this, because never having had any musical training, I convince myself that so much of it is above me.

I know I should really have more courage to think along the lines of b) and c), whereas I too often keep on hammering away at a), convinced that the fault lies with me, and its a fault which I'm determined to overcome.

I'm not quite sure what this will mean for the future effect on my music collection, although I can see the Renaissance and Baroque sections expanding, besides the Religious choral works from all ages, because they are among the works which make me happiest. Although I won't downscale anything as such, I can't see the Liszt, Berlioz, Rachmaninov and Elgar sections growing too large... although I enjoy all of these composers in a certain measure, I feel I'm moving away from the slightly more bombastic style of CM... I would like to be uplifted by my music collection, more than being confronted...

let's see where the next year or so takes me... :-)

[fergus]

....let's see where the next year or so takes me... :-)

You are doing more than OK my friend so leave the slight inferiority complex behind and simply enjoy the music no matter where it takes you! It is all about enjoyment and pleasure....