Tír Na HiFi

mick wrote: 'Good design based on solid engineering priciples' ???

I was referring to the general approach back then as to how how hifi was designed. Far less of the voodoo and nonsense existed.

As for your above example, that appears to have been a manufacturing or assembly defect. If it was a big design flaw it would have showed up in many other Quads and would surely have been fixed.

On the one hand I agree with you, Dave, and I've long despaired of the really silly end of this hobby, where "designers" come up with products that claim to work their magic without any justification for why it might do anything at all. Half-mumbled words like "quantum" are meant to sound scientific enough to throw off the unwary, but it's just utter snake oil. I'm looking at you, Clever Little Clock, etc. Not good for the hobby, not good for anything really.

That said, the classic internet hard-headed objectivist poster is often so arrogant as to make the message worthless, and honestly, I think those people make it just as hard to find the sensible line in the sand as the cable-lifters brigade. The kind of thinking that brings us "we know everything about audio already" is the kind of thinking that gave us "bits is bits, so all transports MUST sound the same". Well yes, until somebody figured out the jitter was a problem. Then there were the THD claims for amplifiers that "prove" the amplifier is perfect, etc. As I mentioned upthread, there are plenty of people out there who will tell you that nothing makes a difference except speakers and room. I find that as unhelpful as the claims that everything makes a difference. (I'm not accusing you of this DaveF, you're far more balanced!)

The problem I still have is to identify my personal line. Up until a few years ago I had no truck with interconnects, etc., but now I believe they make a difference. I can't explain why, I accept that I'd probably fail a blind test, and I can also accept that it might be just placebo, but the differences are "real" to me. Cables are a marketers dream, especially in a world where people can't be dropping massive money to change components all the time, but by playing along I enjoy the hobby more. Perverse perhaps, but there it is. The differences that I hear are reproducible to my ear, not always correlated with price, and rarely correlated with expectation. Does my line stretch to power cables? Probably not, but I still wonder...!

your line and mine must be drawn in different sand...!!

600 quids worth of K-S kettle lead would see me so far over the line I'd need a telescope to see it!!!

jaybee wrote: 600 quids worth of K-S kettle lead would see me so far over the line I'd need a telescope to see it!!!

I didn't set out to buy it, and in many ways I kinda didn't, but that's a story for another day.

sounds incredibly dodge....

The cable was just resting in his system

mick wrote:'Peter Walker, Mr Quad himself, probably one of the most respected men in hifi, whose design in speakers hasn't been bettered today, has said of the indifference a magic power chord will make.

Fair point Mick and well said. The problem is that, that was then but now is now. The mains power supply is no longer as clean and pure as it was even twenty years ago. Mobile phones, computers, Internet routers, Sky boxes, Switched Mode Power Supplies everywhere and so on all contribute, in my honest opinion, to a worsening mains power supply quality. I believe that this worsening mains power supply has a negative effect on the sound of our hi-fi systems. Most people agree that their system sounds better late at night [when everyone else is gone to bed]. It is likely that a lot of the mains pollutants are switched off thus not adding to the mains pollution. This is pure speculation on my part but the theory seems to support the observation. After all if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then it is a ...............

What can we do about this? Mains regeneration is an obvious solution even if it is the most expensive one. I can't recall ever hearing a system with one in place so I cannot comment one way or the other. Mains correction boxes, these purport to fix the AC waveform, I heard one in my system and it did not seem to make much or any difference. Mains cables, distribution boxes, plug in devices [a la Lars and Nordost demos], these may or may not work in your system, they do in mine or at least the cables do. They are easy to try out, plug them in and listen for a few days then revert to your old cable. If the cable improves the sound, it then becomes a balancing act, is a €1K amplifier + a €500 mains cable better than a €1.5K amplifier + its freebie cable? Only you can determine that answer.

The chief improvement I found when I got the mains 'sort of right' is that my system now sounds like music and not like a hi-fi sound. Last year I did try bog standard cables in my system [you may have read my report on this in Hi-Fi+ magazine], the end result was that while the system 'worked', it had no fun factor at all. I like to take my guitar and play along or improvise on themes while listening to music. With the bog standard cables, the guitar remained on its stand. Fun factor is not measurable as far as I know but when I installed all my cables and dumped the freebies, my guitar got played again.

The subject of cables is and continues to be an emotive one. I do not wish to lock horns with anyone on this subject nor do I wish to prolong this debate forever. But I feel that my experiences on cables might be of interest to others and could help unblock their systems sound and reveal its potential. After all you have paid a lot of money for your system, it is about time that it started to pay you back musically.

Thanks Tom. I started this thread because I wanted to hear people's experiences, honestly stated. I certainly didn't want to start an argument, and I'm glad to say that we haven't had one break out yet!

I for one am very glad to hear your views, and that goes for everyone else on the topic as well.

how basic is your current cable...?... wait you'll need a pair won't you...

I have a kimber something or other which you're more than welcome to borrow... see if 600 vs 100 makes a difference?

Yeah, I'd need a pair of whatever I get. Plus, since they go directly into the wall (rather than a power strip) they'd need to be long. Or I could try an audiophile power strip. :)