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Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:59 am
by Aleg
nige2000 wrote:im well aware about the detail/harshness war
were probably at a level where the hardware is holdings us back with noise and jitter and it cant handle the detail coming out of mqn and its sounding like some sort of harsh edgy noise, im very familiar with it and worked hard to keep the detail without the harshness
just feels like were throwing the baby out with the bath water with these new versions
ive been testing rpi and bbb i2s with flip flop reclocking and its good but could not better my pc, with the reclocking it sounds more like mqn
which makes sense
seems like were dumbing down mqn to compensate for noisy jittery hardware
ive no doubt the bbb and twisted pair botic with clean power supplies will best these new mqn versions
it was always the detail, timing, air, atmosphere and realistic sound that set mqn exceptionally apart from all the rest
just seems like such a shame
True, all the best detailed versions didn't sound harsh in my setup either.
But what can one do?
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:06 pm
by nige2000
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:11 pm
by 2channelaudio
nige2000 wrote:im well aware about the detail/harshness war
were probably at a level where the hardware is holdings us back with noise and jitter and it cant handle the detail coming out of mqn and its sounding like some sort of harsh edgy noise, im very familiar with it and worked hard to keep the detail without the harshness
just feels like were throwing the baby out with the bath water with these new versions
ive been testing rpi and bbb i2s with flip flop reclocking and its good but could not better my pc, with the reclocking it sounds more like mqn
which makes sense
seems like were dumbing down mqn to compensate for noisy jittery hardware
ive no doubt the bbb and twisted pair botic with clean power supplies will best these new mqn versions
it was always the detail, timing, air, atmosphere and realistic sound that set mqn exceptionally apart from all the rest
just seems like such a shame
Wow RPI really, I find them horrible sounding things........ what software? every time I have used a RPI (with linear power) for music delivery to my dac its sounds pretty average. Very comparable to a sonos connect/zp90 transport, yuk...
Also, I haven't heard the latest MQN versions (although I will try them on the weekend.) so I can comment there.....
BUT, I'm not sure its necessarily founded to assume listeners who don't prefer more analytic versions of MQN,
must use PC's which render with more jitter?! Especially when one considers the deviation that must exist between front end setups.
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:02 pm
by nige2000
2channelaudio wrote:nige2000 wrote:im well aware about the detail/harshness war
were probably at a level where the hardware is holdings us back with noise and jitter and it cant handle the detail coming out of mqn and its sounding like some sort of harsh edgy noise, im very familiar with it and worked hard to keep the detail without the harshness
just feels like were throwing the baby out with the bath water with these new versions
ive been testing rpi and bbb i2s with flip flop reclocking and its good but could not better my pc, with the reclocking it sounds more like mqn
which makes sense
seems like were dumbing down mqn to compensate for noisy jittery hardware
ive no doubt the bbb and twisted pair botic with clean power supplies will best these new mqn versions
it was always the detail, timing, air, atmosphere and realistic sound that set mqn exceptionally apart from all the rest
just seems like such a shame
Wow RPI really, I find them horrible sounding things........ what software? every time I have used a RPI (with linear power) for music delivery to my dac its sounds pretty average. Very comparable to a sonos connect/zp90 transport, yuk...
Also, I haven't heard the latest MQN versions (although I will try them on the weekend.) so I can comment there.....
BUT, I'm not sure its necessarily founded to assume listeners who don't prefer more analytic versions of MQN,
must use PC's which render with more jitter?! Especially when one considers the deviation that must exist between front end setups.
I2s now not usb
Std Rpi is terrible
Rpi with flip flop reclock is good
Botic will be better and will beat all std pc builds
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:21 pm
by jesuscheung
Aleg wrote:nige2000 wrote:im well aware about the detail/harshness war
were probably at a level where the hardware is holdings us back with noise and jitter and it cant handle the detail coming out of mqn and its sounding like some sort of harsh edgy noise, im very familiar with it and worked hard to keep the detail without the harshness
just feels like were throwing the baby out with the bath water with these new versions
ive been testing rpi and bbb i2s with flip flop reclocking and its good but could not better my pc, with the reclocking it sounds more like mqn
which makes sense
seems like were dumbing down mqn to compensate for noisy jittery hardware
ive no doubt the bbb and twisted pair botic with clean power supplies will best these new mqn versions
it was always the detail, timing, air, atmosphere and realistic sound that set mqn exceptionally apart from all the rest
just seems like such a shame
True, all the best detailed versions didn't sound harsh in my setup either.
But what can one do?
harsh? maybe mqn is correctly reporting something is wrong with the setup....
not harsh here...
i never have had issues with harshness after all voltage values were perfected in bios...
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:30 pm
by jesuscheung
actually, nige2000, i see you tend to lower voltages (ram, cpu etc).
low voltages extract details, but very easily harsh. i can only tell from my experience of dirty power
there is a perfect value for each voltage
believe me i know harsh. i modded my headphones to sound harsher than anything
(at first, i thought i damaged it. actually, my setup sucked. wanted maximum direct sound zero filter)
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:50 pm
by nige2000
jesuscheung wrote:actually, nige2000, i see you tend to lower voltages (ram, cpu etc).
low voltages extract details, but very easily harsh. i can only tell from my experience of dirty power
there is a perfect value for each voltage
believe me i know harsh. i modded my headphones to sound harsher than anything
(at first, i thought i damaged it. actually, my setup sucked. wanted maximum direct sound zero filter)
my setup isnt harsh at all
was just saying i understand what can cause harshness and why some dont like detail because of it
i use to undervolt a little adjusted by ear, used to help lower noise floor etc
but doesnt make much difference with all the clean power its getting now so voltage is left at default settings
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 2:49 pm
by 2channelaudio
nige2000 wrote:2channelaudio wrote:nige2000 wrote:im well aware about the detail/harshness war
were probably at a level where the hardware is holdings us back with noise and jitter and it cant handle the detail coming out of mqn and its sounding like some sort of harsh edgy noise, im very familiar with it and worked hard to keep the detail without the harshness
just feels like were throwing the baby out with the bath water with these new versions
ive been testing rpi and bbb i2s with flip flop reclocking and its good but could not better my pc, with the reclocking it sounds more like mqn
which makes sense
seems like were dumbing down mqn to compensate for noisy jittery hardware
ive no doubt the bbb and twisted pair botic with clean power supplies will best these new mqn versions
it was always the detail, timing, air, atmosphere and realistic sound that set mqn exceptionally apart from all the rest
just seems like such a shame
Wow RPI really, I find them horrible sounding things........ what software? every time I have used a RPI (with linear power) for music delivery to my dac its sounds pretty average. Very comparable to a sonos connect/zp90 transport, yuk...
Also, I haven't heard the latest MQN versions (although I will try them on the weekend.) so I can comment there.....
BUT, I'm not sure its necessarily founded to assume listeners who don't prefer more analytic versions of MQN,
must use PC's which render with more jitter?! Especially when one considers the deviation that must exist between front end setups.
I2s now not usb
Std Rpi is terrible
Rpi with flip flop reclock is good
Botic will be better and will beat all std pc builds
Sorry whats Botic? do you have a link....
cheers
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 2:57 pm
by nige2000
not released yet but soon
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/twisted- ... cance.html
ive tested rpi with ians fifo reclock which is a similar-ish thing
ive tested the bbb which has better quality i2s so the combo will be good
my pc + mqn 10ms still sounds better
Re: MQN
Posted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:04 pm
by Fujak
My feedback regarding the latest versions:
3.75 sounds very detailed, well belanced and vivid.
3.83 sounds too bright without more details than 3.75
3.86 sounds more balanced than 3.83 but less detailed than 3.75
3.57avx sound most detailed and most balanced than any other version.
I hope, that there will be an avx version from 3.75 soon. I guess that will lead to musical extasy. :-)