sima66 wrote:Why then the same mobo cost $300USD more with the OXCO ($539USD)?!
Is it the OXCO that more expensive?!
It is down to the OXCO....it is a much bigger beast with an "Oven" inside so it runs hot!!!!
How about the rest of the components?
Seb mentioned the Xeon processor. Anyone tested the difference between Xeon and one I5 or I7?
How about the RAM? What brand, what to look for? ECC or not (if supported)?
sebna wrote:I use this ram -> http://www.crucial.com/usa/en/blt2k8g3d1608et3lx0 because it operates at lower voltage and still achieves great timings. Both of those mean that memory modules are of high quality. Does this memory sounds any better then any other? I have no idea :)
They are also low profile which might come handy in some pc cases.
Thanks Seb, we probably posted in the same time! :-)
My mentioning of Xeon CPUs was in fact just a byproduct as they are required for the Intel server board. PC based on this server motherboard is almost a perfect solution as it is old enough chipset technology to still truly and natively support SATA 1/2 devices so PPA CF does work on it (or at least for most people) but at the same time, because it is a server board with Xeon CPU it get goodies like AVX2 which with this hardware generation was not available on consumer grade CPUs yet (and next generation of consumer grade chipsets did not support PPA CF anymore but introduced CPUs with AVX2).
So you get best of both worlds. All versions of MQN and PPA CF support. Only problem is that it there are no clock modified motherboards like it so only option is your own experimentation and those clocks are really small on that Intel board :)
Other aspects of server grade equipment is ECC ram, more robust construction (I think there is more then 3 clocks on those boards). But at the same time it will not work with all ECC sticks so you might be for a surprise if you order all online! It has some random problems with TeraDak PSUs and so on. In server world everything is more standardized and ironically more pron to incompatibilities. Even small deviations from perfection or prescribed solution might through it off the balance, even tough it is supposed to work together, at least on the paper.
Other than that Xeons are almost same as consumer grade CPUs. I cannot see them making any reasonable difference to the sound one way or the other but in audio you cannot be sure of anything :)
At the same time all of this chasing of PPA CF might be not worth much as RAMos sounds so good on its own. The problem is, I have no means to compare them so there is always this idea lurking that the grass might be greener on the other side...
And those 2 PPA CFs just seat there and look at me all day long ;)
i5@800mhz haswell, 16gb @800mhz, H87 mb with PPA TCXO, PPA V1 USB
no storage of any kind, SATA disabled in BIOS, RAMos, W2012 R2, AO 1.26, MQN
Teradak ATX LPSU 210W & 5v LPSU for clean 5v to DAC
Meitner MA-1, Primare Pre30 + A33.2, Zingali HM 2.10+
sebna wrote:My mentioning of Xeon CPUs was in fact just a byproduct as they are required for the Intel server board. PC based on this server motherboard is almost a perfect solution as it is old enough chipset technology to still truly and natively support SATA 1/2 devices so PPA CF does work on it (or at least for most people) but at the same time, because it is a server board with Xeon CPU it get goodies like AVX2 which with this hardware generation was not available on consumer grade CPUs yet (and next generation of consumer grade chipsets did not support PPA CF anymore but introduced CPUs with AVX2).
So you get best of both worlds. All versions of MQN and PPA CF support. Only problem is that it there are no clock modified motherboards like it so only option is your own experimentation and those clocks are really small on that Intel board :)
Other aspects of server grade equipment is ECC ram, more robust construction (I think there is more then 3 clocks on those boards). But at the same time it will not work with all ECC sticks so you might be for a surprise if you order all online! It has some random problems with TeraDak PSUs and so on. In server world everything is more standardized and ironically more pron to incompatibilities. Even small deviations from perfection or prescribed solution might through it off the balance, even tough it is supposed to work together, at least on the paper.
Other than that Xeons are almost same as consumer grade CPUs. I cannot see them making any reasonable difference to the sound one way or the other but in audio you cannot be sure of anything :)
At the same time all of this chasing of PPA CF might be not worth much as RAMos sounds so good on its own. The problem is, I have no means to compare them so there is always this idea lurking that the grass might be greener on the other side...
And those 2 PPA CFs just seat there and look at me all day long ;)
That was a very detailed and useful explanation. The picture gets clearer! ;-)
Looks like the Haswell I5 that I have will do the work.
I'm reading a lot of good things about the PPA RAM, but the biggest I saw was 8gb. I don't know if he have a 16gb version?!
Is it 8gb as 2x4gb? But even if so you can by 4 of them to get to 16gb mark. If it is 8gb in one stick then you can reach 32gb easily if you would like to, not to mention 16gb.
However if we forget all audio type of thinking where everything is possible his sticks are very weak in parameters which means they are 3rd grade type of drop-offs which nobody wanted to buy so he got them for 2cents each, kind of memory ;) ... you would not want to get even near to them when thinking about overclocking and for overclocking you need best, cherry picked components (I mean serious overclocking). Most stable available, so stable they can work far beyond their specs, which in audio, overspecing usually also means good results.
But if he really picked them by listening which I seriously doubt then maybe they are so good ... If he would be picking by listening he would never start selling PPA v2 USB as it was serious downgrade in compare to V1 (in fairness the price of v2 is lower then v1 but he claims the difference in quality was very small which is not true IMHO - I have both of them). he just started to sell them as he could no longer source v1 PCB as they went of production... so he went for v2... as it was easy solution.
Same with his PPA card readers. I have two and each of them is of different make and layout... and each of them behaves in different way and has different sets of problems. Again if for him quality of sound would be the utmost priority he would not do it or at least worn users that there are his products are different even tough their name stays the same.
Sorry for a bit of rant but lets not forget he is first and foremost a business men and his marketing as any other should to be taken with pinch of salt.
EDIT: I guess what I am trying to say that if I would be operating within limited budget (which always seems to be the case..) I would buy one of his motherboards with his clock as priority and as to RAM I would go for off the shelf one in oppose to his. Unless you can squeeze in both of those from PPA then why not :)
i5@800mhz haswell, 16gb @800mhz, H87 mb with PPA TCXO, PPA V1 USB
no storage of any kind, SATA disabled in BIOS, RAMos, W2012 R2, AO 1.26, MQN
Teradak ATX LPSU 210W & 5v LPSU for clean 5v to DAC
Meitner MA-1, Primare Pre30 + A33.2, Zingali HM 2.10+
I never trust the seller!!! One of my best friends was an autorized dealer and I blindly trusted him..... untill I realized what a fool I was!!!
I read only a good stuff about PPA RAM's and that's why I asked for more opinions.
So far I'm inclining to his TXCO mobo and still thinking about the rest. Also, I already have I5 Haswell so I guess that that door is closed. :-)
sima66 wrote:I never trust the seller!!! One of my best friends was an autorized dealer and I blindly trusted him..... untill I realized what a fool I was!!!
That sounds like an interesting story ;)
BTW I have PPA RAM filters but I cannot fit them :) as heatsinks of ram are in the way...
i5@800mhz haswell, 16gb @800mhz, H87 mb with PPA TCXO, PPA V1 USB
no storage of any kind, SATA disabled in BIOS, RAMos, W2012 R2, AO 1.26, MQN
Teradak ATX LPSU 210W & 5v LPSU for clean 5v to DAC
Meitner MA-1, Primare Pre30 + A33.2, Zingali HM 2.10+